Nj & NY Different Striper Regulations? Ok for Bass unfair for Fluke?

[Capt Sal]

Originally Posted by TomKaye

Let me see if I understand this proposal. Here's a hypothetical situation :
3 of us go fish a private boat from AHMM. One morning we're lucky enough
to get a 28, a 29 & a 30" striper for the table. Let's imagine we were at Flynn's.

On the same imaginary trip we get a 37" let's say off some NY point. We cannot keep that 37" because
we're berthed in NJ and heading back there, and need a 43" or bigger ???

Pls note we would probably C & R anyway after we got our table fare,
but what if we wanted to feed a neighbor or we have big families ??
WTF is with our politicians ?

It is where your home port is. If you kept two fish say 30 and 34" in Ny last year and were out of AH you were illegal until you entered NJ waters. Years ago when we had a slot fish we had the same problem. I would tell my charter there is no problem keeping the 24-less than 28" bass but once we had one slot fish in the cooler we could not enter NY waters. It cuts the bay in half! Same thing with the fluke,weakfish and winter flounder years ago.On the other hand NY does not allow purse seining of bunker in the bay and NJ does.

[Gerry Zagorski]

Originally Posted by TomKaye

Let me see if I understand this proposal. Here's a hypothetical situation :
3 of us go fish a private boat from AHMM. One morning we're lucky enough
to get a 28, a 29 & a 30" striper for the table. Let's imagine we were at Flynn's.

On the same imaginary trip we get a 37" let's say off some NY point. We cannot keep that 37" because
we're berthed in NJ and heading back there, and need a 43" or bigger ???

Pls note we would probably C & R anyway after we got our table fare,
but what if we wanted to feed a neighbor or we have big families ??
WTF is with our politicians ?

Tom - The way I understand it is even though that fish may be legal when you caught it in NY as long as you stay in NY you are in compliance. The minute you cross over into NJ, you need to be in complaince with NJ Laws.

So, your port of origin makes no difference what so ever. It's all about being in compliance with the local regs in what ever waters you are in at any given time.

The rest of this is not directed at you Tom but for everyone.

We all complained last year when they wanted to change fluke from local to regionally managed. We in NJ wanted to keep our more favorable local regs in place and NY wanted then to be regionalized and they won that argument. Fluke was regionlaized so we now have the same regs in NY and NJ.

Now Stripers come along and we want to keep it by state if it favors our preferences yet we complain about the confusion??

By the way, NY and NJ have had different Striper regulations in place for as long as I can remember and we've always had to deal with the different regs when we crossed boundries, just like we used to have to do with Fluke. We also have different federal regs for Stripers so once you cross over the 3 mile line, you are our of compliance if you have a Striper in your possession.

Some might argue, but I'm in favor of allowing the individual states to govern the regs in their own waters.... Not because I think it makes sense in managing an overall fishery. Fish migrate and spawn in different states and travel through mutiple states so managing the stocks on a state by state basis does not make sense. However, I want our local interests to be represented in our local waters. If you regionalize and lump us in with NY and they happen to have someone representing their interests who has more political power like Schumer, then NJ is going to get screwed.

Lastly and on a more of higher level, I'm of the opinion that the federal government should stick to governing federal issues that effect everyone in this country and keep their noses our of local affairs. Local interests need to be addressed and represented by local people not some bought and paid for fat cat in Washington.

Having said this, local, state or federal it's all about politics and polititcians. They are all self serving a holes but at least the local ones are our a holes

[1captainron]

Now with that being said....Why the Hell doesn't our Governor grow some balls and step up to help us out? For Christ sake if it wasn't for the Sportsman vote, he would have never gotten to where he is today.

[Gerry Zagorski]

Ron - It's all about the political divide in our country. At the time our Governor was with the wrong party to try and infuence anything in Washington. Chuch Shumer happened to be with the right party.

Now that the senate and the house are both a Republican majority, he might have better luck and maybe even more luck when we elect a new President in 2 years.

Not trying to get political here and start a $hit storm, just stating some facts

Both parties have their issues and as I've said before..... Politicians are like diapers... They need to be changed frequently and for the same reason.

[Sea Horse]

Our governor is the least bit to worry about right now. Sen McCain is trying to repeal the Jones Act and if he succedes our US domestic maritime industry (shipping,ferries,fishing etc) will be given up to foreign flag.

JANUARY 15, 2015 — Making the already controversial Keystone Pipepine Bill yet more so, Senator John McCain offered an amendment January 13 that would repeal the Jones Act.

The Senator said: "I have long advocated for a full repeal of The Jones Act, an antiquated law that has for too long hindered free trade, made U.S. industry less competitive and raised prices for American consumers. The amendment I am introducing again today would eliminate this unnecessary, protectionist restriction. According to the Congressional Research Service, it costs $6 per barrel to move crude from the Gulf Coast to the Northeast United States on a Jones Act tanker, while a foreign-flag tanker can take that same crude to a refinery in Canada for $2 per barrel – taking money directly out of the pockets of American consumers. I hope my colleagues will join in this important effort to repeal this archaic legislation to spur job creation and promote free trade."

Needless to say, McCain's move has stirred up a storm of protest.

"The McCain amendment would gut the nation’s shipbuilding capacity, outsource our U.S. Naval shipbuilding to foreign builders, and cost hundreds of thousands of family-wage jobs across this country," said American Maritime Partnership Chairman Tom Allegretti. "The shipbuilding requirement, which Senator McCain seeks to eliminate, is in place to ensure that the United States maintains the industrial capacity to build its own ships, so as to protect and defend the American homeland. It is hard to believe that the Congress would endorse a change to the law that would outsource U.S. jobs and reduce national security by effectively creating dependence on foreign countries to build our ships."

Here's what the Navy League said:

The Navy League of the United States opposes the McCain Amendment(amendment #2) to S.1, which would gut the U.S. shipbuilding industry by striking the U.S. build requirement provisions of the Jones Act.

The Jones Act requires vessels in domestic waterborne trade to be owned by U.S. citizens, built in the United States and crewed by U.S. mariners. These provisions keep American shipping companies, shipyards, mariners, maritime academies and thousands of people working. It is a critical component to the long-term sustainability of the U.S. fleet and the health of the U.S. shipbuilding industry. The Jones Act aids in controlling shipbuilding costs for the Navy, the Marine Corps and the Coast Guard by ensuring the health of the industrial base.

The Carl Levin and Howard P. "Buck" McKeon National Defense Authorization Act of 2015 demonstrates the national security importance of the Jones Act, stating that "coastwise trades laws [such as the Jones Act] promote a strong domestic trade maritime industry, which supports the national security and economic vitality of the United States."

The loss of the American-built provisions in the Jones Act would have devastating ripple effects on all the sea services. Its immediate impact would be a reduction in the number of ships built in U.S. shipyards, which would result in a loss of jobs, a loss of industrial knowledge and skills, and a loss in America's edge in shipbuilding quality and technology.

This would mean all ships used by our U.S. Navy, Marine Corps and Coast Guard, which of course will be built in the United States, would have a higher cost per ship due to increased overhead costs, and would have a less reliable industrial base. A strong industrial base is necessary for innovation and quality.

This amendment would increase costs for the sea services during a time of sequestration and tightening budgets, when each dollar our sea services spend must go farther. The impacts would be extremely detrimental to the sea services

Maritime unions have also expressed their opposition.

"Senator McCain has chosen to offer his amendment at the last minute to an unrelated bill because he knows that if the issue is debated fairly and openly on its merits, he would not be able to defend his position," said MEBA.

"This amendment has no place in the Keystone bill or in Congress," stated SIU President Michael Sacco. "It is just another attack on the Jones Act, one that could cripple the U.S.-flag maritime industry. We need all hands on deck to defeat this amendment.

[FASTEDDIE29]

I miss the slot fish between 24-28 inches! Man, oh man, that's a tasty Striper!!!!

[Capt. Jerry P]

Wasn't trying to start an uproar, piracy, or am I'm bitching n moaning bc I rarely post anything about regulations. Bc I don't believe any of the numbers or how anything is counted when it comes to the actual biomass of stocks and landings... especially fisheries that already faced tough regs on in the past most believe are healthy bc of that

I'm just over here hoping we can keep a seabass next year... Pretty sad I know...

But I just wanted to point out the outcome Nj Anglers would face if the states adopted two very different striper regs. Its alot different than fluke or when stripers was different b4. Where it was easy to understand for most anglers.

There will b two inch slot of stripers that are legal in nj n not in ny and a nj second fish will have to b alot bigger( 7 inches bigger N excluding 34.00001-35.99999 inch) even if fishing in the same spot in ny waters.

Personally I don't even fish in that area Just find it funny (no matter how it's regulated or what scientific way it's different) that in the end will result in same problem ( when it comes to shared waters ) a lot of people complained about for fluke

[Gerry Zagorski]

Did not think that was your intention Jerry. And yes it will cause confusion. This is however a good post. Kinda like those old gramar school reading rention questions I could never figure out...

Lets suppose the regulations get approved as follows:
- NJ is 1 Striper 28 to less than 43 inches with a second of 43 inches or more
- NY is 1 Striper from 28 to 34 inches with a second of 38 inches or more

A charter boat with 6 anglers, a captain and mate on board leaves from NJ. The anglers drink a bunch of beer, one guy gets a bunker snag stuck in his hand and can't fish so he goes in the cabin and takes a nap. That makes him sick so he throws up all over the cabin. The others are busting his balls but they keep on fishing with their spining reels but are using them upside down.

The Captain and mate are shaking their heads in disbelief that these guys are such hacks so they themselves proceed to fish. They catch and retain 9 Stripers.... 7 that are between 28 and 32 inches and 2 that are 38 and 47 inches.

By mistake they drift over into NY waters and are stopped and boarded by the NY DEP. To add insult to injury when they arrive back at the dock at the end of the day, there is an NJ DEP person checking all the boats.

Questions:
- Were they in compliance when they were boarded in NY waters?
- Were they in compliance when they got checked at the dock in NJ?
- If they were out of compliance who gets the summons?

On the lighter side:
- What would this fishing report look like if it where posted on NJfishing.com?
- Who gets stuck with the job of cleaning up the puke in the cabin?
- Should everyone have stopped fishing and gone home when the guy got the bunker snag stuck in his hand?

Can't wait to see some of the creative responses here

[dales529]

Originally Posted by Gerry Zagorski

Did not think that was your intention Jerry. And yes it will cause confusion. This is however a good post. Kinda like those old gramar school reading rention questions I could never figure out...

Lets suppose the regulations get approved as follows:
- NJ is 1 Striper 28 to less than 43 inches with a second of 43 inches or more
- NY is 1 Striper from 28 to 34 inches with a second of 38 inches or more

A charter boat with 6 anglers, a captain and mate on board leaves from NJ. The anglers drink a bunch of beer, one guy gets a bunker snag stuck in his hand and can't fish so he goes in the cabin and takes a nap. That makes him sick so he throws up all over the cabin. The others are busting his balls but they keep on fishing with their spining reels but are using them upside down.

The Captain and mate are shaking their heads in disbelief that these guys are such hacks so they themselves proceed to fish. They catch and retain 9 Stripers.... 7 that are between 28 and 32 inches and 2 that are 38 and 47 inches.

By mistake they drift over into NY waters and are stopped and boarded by the NY DEP. To add insult to injury when they arrive back at the dock at the end of the day, there is an NJ DEP person checking all the boats.

Questions:
- Were they in compliance when they were boarded in NY waters?
- Were they in compliance when they got checked at the dock in NJ?
- If they were out of compliance who gets the summons?

On the lighter side:
- What would this fishing report look like if it where posted on NJfishing.com?
- Who gets stuck with the job of cleaning up the puke in the cabin?
- Should everyone have stopped fishing and gone home when the guy got the bunker sang stuck in his hand?

Can't wait to see some of the creative responses here

Sounds like they came up from Philly so rules don't apply

[jmurr711]

Originally Posted by dales529

Sounds like they came up from Philly so rules don't apply

excuse me?