The charter/party industry...

[jenny lee sportfishing]

vin,

i did not read all five pages, i'm sorry i just can't do it. i have operated jenny lee sportfishing for the last 13 years and consider my operation to be first class. however, i am a part time charter operation, meaning although we are available everyday of the season, we all augmnet our income working fulltime in other industries/business'. aside from the head boats there are only a few operations in which the employees/owner's are solefully dependent on their charter business, and my hat goes off to all of them.
i have owned and operated dave's heavy towing for the past 38 years and at one time i was one of the top operations in the state and perhaps the east coast, but competition and low pricie have changed all of that, as it has done to the for hire fishing business.
you see somehow, a guy comes into business with little or no expierience in operating a business and figures out that his competitors are gouging the public and he can do it much cheaper. after all 38 years, what could i possibly know about running a business, just like the bogans or raagula, or larosa families, what do they know. after decades in business, you should have some knowlegde of what it costs to operate, make some money, and of course pay your help well enough so they stick around and oh yea, improve or upgrade your equipment/ boats/ tackle/ etc.

when we started chartering i promised my self that i would operate jenny lee as i do dave's heavy towing, with the utmost in professionalism, and saftey, and not cut price or quality just to say" i'm a charter business"
this is not a knock on anyone who is chartering or thinking about it, by no means, it is america, but you are 100% correct their are far too many start up so called charter boats that are crapping up the stream for the few really true charter operations, and i'm not sure if it's ego or dollars or both.

please exuse me for the rant, but it's the truth. i'm the last man to judge anyone, i am a part time charter operation, however, i feel i maintain the highest quality of respect for the industry and my peers.

repsectfully
capt dave bender

[Captain Rich]

I'm going to add another thought to this thread, I started around the same time as Dave Bender and respect his opinions and operation. I also run part time. As Vinny pointed out in the start of this thread, charter rates in this metropolitan area are lower than most other geographic areas. I fish out of Jupiter during the winter and the drift boats there get $75/head for a half day trip and run less than 5 miles. During the winter they are booked up solid and run two trips/day. Considering the distances we travel, charter rates here are a bargain. Our spring clamming trips up to Raritan Bay are 25 miles each way. When I talk to captains out of our area about our canyon trips with runs of 80 to 100 miles each way, they think we are nuts to charge as little as we do. The cost of fuel is what makes or breaks us in the charter industry.

[Taxman]

Some can run on reputation

New comers to market need pricing until they establish their reputation

Companies offer lower prices to build market share all of the time

[Harpoon]

But ultimately the consumer wins out with choices. We can choose the port, boat, crew that we want to fish with and someone that is in our price range. That keeps anglers interested and helps the industry as a whole cause we keep fishing. That also keeps sites like this in business since they are a place for advertisers. Now from a personal business perspective its gotta be a brutal industry to be in...especially if its your full time gig but ultimately that was your choice in the beginning of it all.

I would compare it too moving next to an airport that been in operation for 100 years and then asking said airport to lower the noise level after you move in. You knew from the beginning the fishing industry is tough and you have to be ready to weather all the changes no matter where they come from. I would say this happens in many different industries...not just the fishing industry.

[Captain Ahab]

Originally Posted by Harpoon

But ultimately the consumer wins out with choices. We can choose the port, boat, crew that we want to fish with and someone that is in our price range. That keeps anglers interested and helps the industry as a whole cause we keep fishing. That also keeps sites like this in business since they are a place for advertisers. Now from a personal business perspective its gotta be a brutal industry to be in...especially if its your full time gig but ultimately that was your choice in the beginning of it all.

I would compare it too moving next to an airport that been in operation for 100 years and then asking said airport to lower the noise level after you move in. You knew from the beginning the fishing industry is tough and you have to be ready to weather all the changes no matter where they come from. I would say this happens in many different industries...not just the fishing industry.

Hey Jon - I guess you are still alive

Any word on when I can get the stuff back?

[Fish Tank]

I've been thinking about this for a while and don't think there is any right or wrong answer here, just different ways of looking at things. Some businesses make their money by volume and others make money by higher margins.

Walmart can sell a handbag for $30 meanwhile my fiance' makes me spend $300 at a Coach store! They both probably cost around $10 to make and can hold the same amount of stuff (which is the whole purpose of a bag, isn't it?), but the difference is that most of the population can afford the Walmart bag and once you get into the Coach pricerange, you have narrowed down the market of potential buyers. At the end of the year, if Walmart sells 10x the amount of bags than Coach does because their market of potential buyers is 10x greater, don't they both make the same amount of $? The same applies in this business as well.

Some operations are geared towards the higher-end clientele who expect a large, fast, vessel with a mate ready to retie rigs and dehook your fish, a nice galley with breakfast served on the way out, top of the line reels on custom rods, an endless supply of sinkers and tackle, etc. For that, I can certainly agree that there should be a premium associated with that type of service.

On the other hand, there are some boats that have a clientele base of people that just want to fish as much as possible. For those people, they are willing to sacrifice some of those additional ammenities for a lower price point which allows them to fish 4-5xs per month instead of 2-3.

That is what originally attracted me to Capt. Tommy's boat, "Right Away II", and why I have been a weekly regular of his for the past 10 years and now have entered into business with him. I have my own equipment and tackle and bring my lunch (mostly Coors Light with an occasional sandwich if I remember to pack it). I enjoy tying my own rigs and releasing my own fish. I don't have a problem hauling an anchor if necessary or picking up a brush and wiping down the gunnels. To me, that is all part of the sport of fishing and the fact that I was able to fish more often because of that made it all worth it.

Just because Capt. Tommy's business model is a little different compared to some of the other boats (a large customer base of weekly regulars instead of less frequent fares) doesn't mean we catch less fish, aren't willing to travel farther to find the bite and aren't making money. In fact, a lot of the posts/responses we have received on this site reference him as arguably one of the best bottomfishermen in the area.

I understand not everyone has the same opinion as me and that is the beauty of this site. It allows each of us to speak openly about certain topics and get different perspectives from a wide range of people.

Tight Lines!

~Capt. Kevin

P.S. If anyone would prefer to pay $200 for an open boat spot, we will gladly oblige

[Skolmann]

Fish Tank, agree 100%.

[joeya78]

Originally Posted by Captain Rich Adler

I'm going to add another thought to this thread, I started around the same time as Dave Bender and respect his opinions and operation. I also run part time. As Vinny pointed out in the start of this thread, charter rates in this metropolitan area are lower than most other geographic areas. I fish out of Jupiter during the winter and the drift boats there get $75/head for a half day trip and run less than 5 miles. During the winter they are booked up solid and run two trips/day. Considering the distances we travel, charter rates here are a bargain. Our spring clamming trips up to Raritan Bay are 25 miles each way. When I talk to captains out of our area about our canyon trips with runs of 80 to 100 miles each way, they think we are nuts to charge as little as we do. The cost of fuel is what makes or breaks us in the charter industry.

its a double ended sword, how about the boats that come out of port and are fishing within 1 mile of running?

[sportfishingusa]

Originally Posted by joeya78

its a double ended sword, how about the boats that come out of port and are fishing within 1 mile of running?

boats in sailfish marina that go sailfishing and such in florida are getting upwards of 2500 per day to do that, then you have to pay extra for live bait, they go a few miles off the beach, sometimes 3 miles to the ledge and start fishing, we have boats up here getting 2500 for a day troll that is burning 400 gallons of fuel lol

[sportfishingusa]

Originally Posted by jenny lee sportfishing

vin,

i did not read all five pages, i'm sorry i just can't do it. i have operated jenny lee sportfishing for the last 13 years and consider my operation to be first class. however, i am a part time charter operation, meaning although we are available everyday of the season, we all augmnet our income working fulltime in other industries/business'. aside from the head boats there are only a few operations in which the employees/owner's are solefully dependent on their charter business, and my hat goes off to all of them.
i have owned and operated dave's heavy towing for the past 38 years and at one time i was one of the top operations in the state and perhaps the east coast, but competition and low pricie have changed all of that, as it has done to the for hire fishing business.
you see somehow, a guy comes into business with little or no expierience in operating a business and figures out that his competitors are gouging the public and he can do it much cheaper. after all 38 years, what could i possibly know about running a business, just like the bogans or raagula, or larosa families, what do they know. after decades in business, you should have some knowlegde of what it costs to operate, make some money, and of course pay your help well enough so they stick around and oh yea, improve or upgrade your equipment/ boats/ tackle/ etc.

when we started chartering i promised my self that i would operate jenny lee as i do dave's heavy towing, with the utmost in professionalism, and saftey, and not cut price or quality just to say" i'm a charter business"
this is not a knock on anyone who is chartering or thinking about it, by no means, it is america, but you are 100% correct their are far too many start up so called charter boats that are crapping up the stream for the few really true charter operations, and i'm not sure if it's ego or dollars or both.

please exuse me for the rant, but it's the truth. i'm the last man to judge anyone, i am a part time charter operation, however, i feel i maintain the highest quality of respect for the industry and my peers.

repsectfully
capt dave bender

Thank you dave, and i always forget that you own daves towing, i will keep you in mind next time i need a heavy up your way, i am also in the towing business, myself for 12 years and my father for 32! I appreciate your response and you are spot on, some times you have to sell yourself short to make ends meet at one time or another, but thats business sometimes.. You response is dead on and greatly appreciated!!