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-   -   Some Comments on Fluke (https://www.njfishing.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44070)

captadamnj 03-02-2012 08:06 AM

Some Comments on Fluke
 
Having attended and spoken at the NJ Marine Fisheries Council meeting yesterday, I will share my thoughts on the outcomes.

All options presented are considered "conservationally equivalent", meaning that in a perfect world, all will result in the same recreational landings of fish (in pounds). The "perfect world" makes many assumptions, with the most critical of which being that "effort and availability will remain the same as the previous year". We all know this is not true. Weather will be different. Cost of fishing (fuel, etc.) will effect the trips we sail. Fish migration patterns will differ affecting the when and the where we can catch fish. Factor in to that the variability of MRFSS which is simply an estimating tool based on a sampling of less than 1% of the fishing effort/landings and it is quickly apparent why we can't ever catch "exactly" our target. For these reasons, we have no idea what MRFSS is going to spit out for rec landings irregardless of the regulations.

I will, however, put forth the following information which was the basis for my decision to speak on behalf of 17.5". I understand that many of the opinions express on this board and at the meeting yesterday come from avid highly successful fishermen whom enjoyed a great deal of success last year. I commend and respect you for that. Understand, however, that there are hundreds of thousands of other fishermen/women that do not enjoy the successes you have had.

1) We did NOT lose season. The 2012 season is 5 DAYS LONGER THAN LAST YEAR and is the LONGEST IN A NUMBER OF YEARS.

2) The highest reported landings according to MRFSS have historically come from the longest open seasons. If your season is open, MRFSS reports landings no matter the known availability of fish, weather, etc.

3) NY has become the poster child of the negative impacts of MRFSS when choosing to go with longest possible seasons by the use of higher minimum sizes. Most would agree that hasn't worked.

4) The NJ Marine Fisheries Council, as LAB posted, has been within a couple % over an extended period of our target landings. Their management mechanism of choice over this time span has been to use size as the primary management tool as opposed to always trying for the longest possible season. The decision yesterday to again manage by size instead of opting for the longest possible season is consistent with that history and will, hopefully, continue the trend of relative success managing to the target.

5) The technical committee of the Atlantic States Marine Fisheries Commission composed of state biologists have stated time and time again that the best way to constrain harvest is through season. This decision is again consistent with that advice.

Again, I commend those of you "sharpies" that have enjoyed success at 18". You are the 10% that catch 90% of the fish as the saying goes. I understand and respect your position, but the decision passed down yesterday is consistent with the best information for constraining harvest to the target and will benefit many anglers giving them a better opportunity to harvest a fish to bring home.

Your mileage will vary on the above. Thanks to all whom have and continue to take the time to participate in the process.

Tony Cav 03-02-2012 08:44 AM

Re: Some Comments on Fluke
 
I am not a fluke sharpie and think that those of us doing a majority of our fishing in the Manasquan river from boat and wall are very pleased with this outcome. Absolutely!

irishc 03-02-2012 08:55 AM

Re: Some Comments on Fluke
 
Very well said capt.

PocketFisherman 03-02-2012 10:02 AM

Re: Some Comments on Fluke
 
Given that argument - shouldn't you have voted for Option 6?

Pete 03-02-2012 10:57 AM

Re: Some Comments on Fluke
 
Capt. Adam,

Thanks for your explanation of the new regulations and your reasons for supporting them. I wish you had weighed in on the poll before the vote was conducted. You may have opened up some eyes, then again, maybe not. Are the regulations agreed upon yesterday perfect? Probably not, I guess time will tell. But, they are put forth in hopes of making it better for all fishermen. Hopefully MRFSS will open their eyes, and realize that the fishing public does act responsibly and does desire to come up with a management plan that we can all live with. But, year in and year out we are at their mercy.

Good or bad it is what it is guys. Hopefully, next year you will get what you want, whatever that may be. I can assure we will never get back to the no min. and no closed season ever again. But, I believe that unbridled horse is what got us here in the first place.

Good luck! Catch 'em up.

Thanks to all the guys who showed up yesterday. No matter what option you favored. You at least showed commitment for your cause.

broken bobber 03-02-2012 12:04 PM

Re: Some Comments on Fluke
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by PocketFisherman
Given that argument - shouldn't you have voted for Option 6?

Thank You..... :)

DMac 03-02-2012 01:41 PM

Re: Some Comments on Fluke
 
I don't post on here a lot anymore, but I can not sit here and not comment at all on this. So we have lived at the 18" rule for 3 season now and last year I really saw the average size of the fish improve and it would continue to improve the longer you left the size limit at a certain size. Now we drop the size a 1/2" which I believe will have little impact on the number of "just short" fluke people will catch. Its about fishing areas that do not get the pressure or knowing how and when and with what to use to bring the bigger fish out to play. Yes dragging spearing ad squid will catch big fluke, but more big fish will be caught when you target them. You can take the biggest fluke sharpie in NJ of his boat/chosen for hire boat take away all his typical tackle and techniques and give him a rental rod and single hook with 40 people on a party boat all with the same bait right next to one another and while he might do better than most. He will not catch the same quality fish he would while fishing on his boat/chosen boat to hire using the skills and techniques he has developed over the years of learning and improving. So because people have worked to become better fisherman and be able to catch fish when others cant we have to suffer with shorter season and lower bag limit. How about the other 90% you talk about stepping up their game a little bit. Ill admit it I have a major addiction problem when it comes to fishing. If the government banned fishing I would rather be in prison or dead than stop. I work to pay for my fishing addiction, and it is my sanity in a F-d up world.

So now we have nothing inshore to fish for but stripers for part of the month of October, great so every boat on the ocean will be targeting one fish that should be great. I know you will come back and say blues and albies, and ling, but honestly albies could be gone depending on weather, and so could the blues. Both seabass and blackfish are closed for a big part of October.

Might even pull my boat earlier this year.

I will end by saying that I understand the desire to give people a better chance at catching keepers, but as soon as areas get picked over for a few weeks you will be throwing back a lot of 17 3/8 inch fish.

Throwing shorts back is a good thing makes me see the stock is health and i always say see you in a few years when I toss them back. Plus I never net a fluke even if I think it might be close to being a short or if I intend on releasing it anyway. I do not buy that throwback die if handled properly. Be kind to the future fish you will be catching no towels, cut the hook off if you have a deeply hooked fish it will rust out, don't put your hand in gills unless your taking picture prior to putting it in the box.

Ok I'm done.

I was so defeated when I heard the news. I didn't attend the meeting because it is over 2 hrs away and I could not take the day off work. I did attend the bft meeting last year and that really did not do anything for us.

mako28 03-02-2012 01:42 PM

Re: Some Comments on Fluke
 
It's very disturbing to me that a charter boat capt. and chairman of rfa is actually is voting for less size and bag limit. Do you realize that these laws that you voted for are the same that bought NY to it's knees? It's also disturbing that a charter boat captain voted to reduced size and bag limits, thats shows signs of weakness as far the captain of Karen Ann 2 goes. If you can't limit out with 8 fish at 18", you may think that at 17.5 and 5 fish a man, your chances will be easier. My opinion is if you had a 2 fish limit at 17", you still would have a problem limiting out. I'm just so disgusted as a fisherman of 40 years that there are captains out there in 2012 that actually will vote for a reduction in their catch. By any chance did you vote to have helicopters enforce the 3 mile limit when striper fishing? Next sea bass and tautog meeting I will attend to vote for a complete shut down of both, since you snj guys depend on that dearly and have destroyed fluke regs., we can both sell our boats and you and I can golf

PocketFisherman 03-02-2012 01:48 PM

Re: Some Comments on Fluke
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mako28
It's very disturbing to me that a charter boat capt. and chairman of rfa is actually is voting for less size and bag limit. Do you realize that these laws that you voted for are the same that bought NY to it's knees? It's also disturbing that a charter boat captain voted to reduced size and bag limits, thats shows signs of weakness as far the captain of Karen Ann 2 goes. If you can't limit out with 8 fish at 18", you may think that at 17.5 and 5 fish a man, your chances will be easier. My opinion is if you had a 2 fish limit at 17", you still would have a problem limiting out. I'm just so disgusted as a fisherman of 40 years that there are captains out there in 2012 that actually will vote for a reduction in their catch. By any chance did you vote to have helicopters enforce the 3 mile limit when striper fishing? Next sea bass and tautog meeting I will attend to vote for a complete shut down of both, since you snj guys depend on that dearly and have destroyed fluke regs., we can both sell our boats and you and I can golf

Put down the pipe

DMac 03-02-2012 01:54 PM

Re: Some Comments on Fluke
 
oh yeah almost forgot if you want to email send me a PM me I will gladly send it to you just don't want to make my personal email public on public forum. Ill give you my phone to if you would like to discuss or even meet you for a drink if you want to chat over a few cold ones I really am a sensible guy that just enjoys fishing.

Have a great day


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