Re: Is it just me...?
 

There you go again Tony a real thread killer:D You present facts and people still do not get it. This is great asset for all fisherman. Rsa is not for PB/Charters to make a living its to fund research for OUR fisheries. Pay our own way. As you explained to many on the internet(and myself in person) this program is a big win for fisherman and has been working well for many years. As I understand it( and please correct me if I am wrong) about the only thing that has changed is that more states will issue free landing permits and that in-turn will now allow charter/party permit holders to bid on RSA quota in those states. Where is the giant conspiracy and all the fraud. It blows when peoples agendas gets in the way of the facts. If your life sucks and you hate the government awesome:) If you think the seasons are too short and size limits are too big wonderful:) All of that has nothing to do with RSA. Plenty of battles to fight for our fisheries but we need facts and science to win. How many saltwater fisherman are there in NJ? 400,000 or 1,000,000 who knows . If you look at how many registered this year you would say not too many.

Re: Is it just me...?
 

Very simple:

The current data is against us right now in terms of fisheries data. We need better data, better data takes money. We need money to pay for this. Everyone won't write a check for $1000, we need RSA. That simple.


Data bad=need to fix=need better science=need more $=RSA helps.

We're only shooting ourselves in the foot here. You think the government only exists to conspire against you, go to another country and find a new government. If not, try to work with them to get the $ for reaserch that we so desperately need.

Re: Is it just me...?
 

So does someone actually show up after every trip to do the calculations and measurements or is it random ? If so is it up to the crew to do the work back at the dock? Hats off to whomever has to log all that info prior to fileting. Finally some sound numbers that are in our favor!

Re: Is it just me...?
 

No conspriacy theories here....I don't care who the $$ goes to...but I am sure the info collected by the researchers is going to the Gov.

I would never pay $30 or $3 to extend a fluke season... anyway you look at it.... it's info that that very well could effect our future as saltwater fisherman.

Another fluke season come to a end....I here the bottom fishing is good!

Re: Is it just me...?
 

I AGREE WITH YOU 110%....its a money thing.....

Re: Is it just me...?
 

Because clearly knowing how many pounds of fluke the average party boat brings in on a daily basis isn't going to somehow provide accurate data right? Not to mention any other research that may be useful. Like if they check the racks and find out that 90% of the fish at the size we are keeping are females and that we're doing more harm than good. So they make adjustments accordingly?

It's all about the money though, and our president is a muslim, Kennedy was killed by a magic bullet made of frozen meat fired from a grassy knoll, and we didn't ever really go to the moon...

Re: Is it just me...?
 

Couldn't this be been done on any day, on any boat, during the regular fluke season? All summer we fileted our fish at the dock, put the racks in a bag, tagged them, and put them in Petes freezer. I love fluke fishing and my season is over unless i want to pay to go on a party boat while my boat sits at the dock. I am all for the research 100% but its a tough pill to swallow watching the rsa boats going out fluking while iam in my slip waiting for the bass run.

Re: Is it just me...?
 

What is being confused here (and that is partly my fault since my posts are so friggin long winded I don't blame all of you for not reading every word:D)
is the "research" part of this.

Yes, data is being collected from the boats actually doing the trips.

However, that is NOT the research being paid for with the purchase of the quota. Any data collected from the RSA trips themselves is a BONUS and is ABOVE AND BEYOND the research that is paid for with the purchase of the quota by these boats and the commercial boats.

There is a whole list of research projects that are currently being funded either in part or in whole with the money generated from the sale of the RSA quota from each species. Some research gets funded with quota from several species (it is irrelevant what the fish is, it is the money generated from the sale of those fish that pays for the research)

These projects are submitted to the MAFMC in 2009. They are then approved for the 2010 fishing year (some projects span multiple years) and quota is assigned to them to then be sold and help pay for or offset the estimated costs of those projects.

Early in 2010 the quota is auctioned off, and the money is then given to the research projects based on how much quota was assigned to each project and subsequently how much that quota sold for per pound.

The fact that additional data like lengths and weights is collected when those fish are actually harvested is simply additional data that did not cost anything to collect.

Here is an example of a few projects that were funded in the past couple years: (project name in italics, recipient of funds in bold)

Discard Mortality in the Summer Flounder Fishery: A New Approach to Evaluation - National Fisheries Institute

Data collection and analysis in support of single and multispecies stock assessments in the Mid-Atlantic: Northeast Area Monitoring and Assessment Program Near Shore Trawl Program - Virginia Institute of Marine Science

2008 Fishery Independent Scup Survey of Hard Bottom Areas in Southern New England Waters - Charles Borden and Eric Rodegast

Evaluation of Summer Flounder Discard Mortality in the Bottom Trawl Fishery - Cornell Cooperative Ext. of Suffolk County

Development of a Supplemental Finfish Survey Targeting Mid-Atlantic Migratory Species - National Fisheries Institute

Re: Is it just me...?
 

I think there is a difference without distinction here...

The RSA money comes from the private sector and doesn't go to "the man" at all if I understand correctly. The people using the resource pay for the research, which at first glance does not seem controversial at all.
However, my parents used to pay $6k per year in property taxes and it was all inclusive for school supplies, athletics, extracurriculars, etc. not to mention garbage and other services.

Now, I pay $30K on an adjusted basis and get no garbage service, we have "fundraisers" for a public school in one of the highest income areas in the US to buy pencils and paper, and we don't get deer picked up when they're dead on the side of the road.

The RSA money may never touch Govt. hands, but haven't they abdicated one of their old responsibilities without a commensurate reduction in the taxes we pay? What would the regulation be based on if not science? My municipality doesn't get any of the money that I pay my garbage company, but I never got a refund when they stopped providing it either.

Another interesting situation is "whose science" is being funded? A very different story if rec and commercial fishermen are both paying for the same "impartial" science. Ditto the science that us fishermen want to show that stocks are healthy and are willing to pay for but not if if it's used to show that we should stop fishing.

I applaud all of you who are so well versed in this issue; for those of you whose living is at stake it would be irresponsible if you weren't as informed. Like many other areas of regulation, there is sometimes a calculated morass of jargon, legalese, and double talk intended to make most people throw up their hands. Thank you all for sifting through it and helping us understand.

Re: Is it just me...?
 

TB, you are a very patient man:)

thanks for your commitment