Ethical Ice Fishermen

[CPR1]

I see there are a lot of hard water fishermen on this board. My hope is that all the ethical ice fishermen out there this year keep tabs on those who don't always follow the rules. The ice fishing period is a time where big spawners can be vulnerable - especially Walleyes and Muskies. Not all fishermen realize the importance of these fish to a fishery. Some ice fishermen who don't own boats are limited to the shore during soft water periods. Some of these folks are the ones that carry buckets around...enough said. During hard water, these folks can position in key areas and can be much more effective getting to target species they typically can't reach from the shore. There are many good people on this board. I ask that you keep an eye out for those who are not following regulations and to encourage C&R of trophy fish. I don't know the regulations on how many baits you can have out there but this is also something to keep an eye on. Just politely mentioning the regulations to people is enough to make them think twice. If you want to go after them with your auger, that is another option... ;o) I am just being conservation-minded and thinking of our great fisheries. Everyone have a safe ice season.

[Chrisper4694]

5 per person total (if you're jigging, 4 tip ups; 5 tip ups if that's all you're doing)

good luck, they usually don't speak english and a f&w rep has never come in time to catch them the 4-5 times we've called a report in...

[Andrushkin33]

Last time I checked it was 5 tip ups as mentioned or 3 jig rods per person.

As far as c&r goes. Unfortunetly I know my share of the bucket brigades and always try to do my best when I am out fishing around them. Being from a different country their mentality is completely different and it takes awhile for them to see things your way. Most are aware of the rules just choose to ignore them completely when it comes to limits and size.

Andre

[lennysky]

Because most those who don't follow rules come w their friends, I would be careful approaching them with criticism as I've seen them get argumentative

[Andrushkin33]

Because most those who don't follow rules come w their friends, I would be careful approaching them with criticism as I've seen them get argumentative

Agreed but being from the same country and speaking same language goes a long way at least in my case.

Andre

[lennysky]

Are you russian or polish?

[Andrushkin33]

Are you russian or polish?

Russian born and raised. Polish I know a little but don't speak it but most of the time can communicate ad get my point across.

Andre

[lennysky]

Same here. Came from Lvov in 1980 live in mountain lakes nj

[Andrushkin33]

Same here. Came from Lvov in 1980 live in mountain lakes nj

Pleasure. Man in 1980 I was still a pup. St Petersburg came over in 92 and pretty much was all over the place. Now in Linden nj.

Andre

[lennysky]

Fishing since 6yo. Started in Black Sea for gobies. Good times

[Andrushkin33]

About same for me. Fishing for pike pickerel perch and trout.

First at Ladoga lake and then surrounding areas ponds and streams.

Also for lesh ( I don't know the English name for it ) and would love to catch some here but have no idea if they even exist here.

Lol and you know Russian regulations. As long as you not using dynamite you pretty much allowed to do whatever you want.

Andre

[lennysky]

For a bottle of vodka even dynamite would be permissible. Lesh (Bream - Abramis Brama) available in Canada but not US. I would love to find Lin (tench) here in the US. It is considered undesirable species though. I used to live in Linden off of Woodlawn ave

[Andrushkin33]

Yeah that's true.

And don't forget the party leaders on vacation that used to bleed local lakes dry. Man I remember fishing White River in what now Bashkorastan. My early stocking efforts. Used to catch tons of baby pickerels and stock them in local ponds and lakes so I can have better fishing grounds. Have not idea of it ever working but something just needed to get done.

And I wonder if crawfish and crawdads get to the same size we used to have. So nice to have one with a beer after a long day.

Andre

[lennysky]

I used to catch huge crawfish in Ukraine. Easily size of an adult hand. But I've seen good size crawfish in US as well. 4-5"

[stevejordan]

on champlain you can have 15 tip ups per person lol

[Andrushkin33]

on champlain you can have 15 tip ups per person lol

Lol I don't know how you can keep up with that many. 5 looks like a lot of work for me I cant imagine looking over 15 of them

Andre

[lennysky]

When I go to bigger lakes I usually go with several friends. We each bring 5 and set up a pattern. Otherwise it is really difficult to figure out the fishing pattern. When I learn the lake, I bring 3

[stevejordan]

Lol I don't know how you can keep up with that many. 5 looks like a lot of work for me I cant imagine looking over 15 of them

Andre

sure would go through lots of bait

[Andrushkin33]

sure would go through lots of bait

That's for sure. Reason I said this though I went with couple of my friends to a private lake ice fishing last season (I wasn't fishing was there for free alcohol) They had 10 between both of them and then 7 flags went up within a minute. Man I had fun watching them run like chickens without the head. That kind of flag show made me want to try it out this year. And after seeing all of the pictures you maniacs put up here makes me wanna be out even more.

[lennysky]

Andrew, we can make it happen for you any time. I go pretty much weekly now. Mostly during the week mid day. We can do private venue or Splitrock or greenwood lake

[Andrushkin33]

Andrew, we can make it happen for you any time. I go pretty much weekly now. Mostly during the week mid day. We can do private venue or Splitrock or greenwood lake

Thanks man. Definetly something I would want to try. I will be up at Hopatcong on Saturday but would love to try Greenwood. Never fished there. If ice will hold lets try out something next weekend if you got the time. Weekdays are hard for me unless you want to get out at night.

Andre

[lennysky]

It gets bitterly cold on greenwood at night even in a shelter w a heater. Let me know how Hopatcong works out, but I think it does not get really good there until February.

[Andrushkin33]

Last Saturday we had about 6 bass between 4 of us. On Sunday though bucket brigate was out in full force and pretty much went slaying them up and down. Based on pictures I seen perch was the most caught, followed by pickerel and some bass as well.

[lennysky]

I don't enjoy eating bass unless it's smallmouth and then I feel bad keeping smallness as they such a good gamefish. I usually target panfish and walleyes.

[njflyfisher]

Last Saturday we had about 6 bass between 4 of us. On Sunday though bucket brigate was out in full force and pretty much went slaying them up and down. Based on pictures I seen perch was the most caught, followed by pickerel and some bass as well.

Where you at the state park on sunday? I saw 3 rusian guys fishing there?

[Chrisper4694]

Don't feel bad about keeping small legal bass! It helps the fishery grow more big fish!

[lennysky]

You are right. I keep small fish but give them to my family and friends.

[zhitoman]

Same here. Came from Lvov in 1980 live in mountain lakes nj

From the Ukraine as well.

[zhitoman]

For a bottle of vodka even dynamite would be permissible. Lesh (Bream - Abramis Brama) available in Canada but not US. I would love to find Lin (tench) here in the US. It is considered undesirable species though. I used to live in Linden off of Woodlawn ave

I am looking for wild goldfish for years now lol.

[lennysky]

Looking for karasik?

[Andrushkin33]

Or krasnoperka .....but I know krasnoperka can be caught around here.

[lennysky]

Red fin shiner is definitely around as is the common shiner. I caught common shiners up to 1.5 pounds

[Eskimo]

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Being from a different country their mentality is completely different and it takes awhile for them to see things your way. Most are aware of the rules just choose to ignore them completely when it comes to limits and size.

I agree. I don't want to get too specific, because people on this board say I'm offensive, but I've noticed that anglers who have immigrated from a kleptocracy approach fishing like they just won a free shopping spree.

They are going to bring every damn fish they caught home, even if they have to shove that fish up their ass to sneak it past the park police.

I've seen it too many times: a limit of fish goes on the stringer - everything over that goes into the backpack. Right?

They can't believe the abundance of gamefish in America and don't understand why we're not all just looting the waters for all they're worth. They don't see the generations of work and voluntary conservation that went into building the quality of fishing we have here today.



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[lennysky]

Back in Ukraine, fish of all sizes were kept to feed families as a necessity as fish was rarely available at the market and the ones that were sold smelled like diesel. Even my family questions my catch and release reasoning time and time again. It takes decades to change people's outlook and only if they are open to it. I have some foreign fisherman that practice strict catch and release but it's not the norm. I see the same in our estuary and salt fisheries when it comes to stripers and fluke

[zhitoman]

Red fin shiner is definitely around as is the common shiner. I caught common shiners up to 1.5 pounds
You mean golden shiners? I catch a lot of them, where do you fish for big ones?

[lennysky]

In the spring they spawn and big ones are close to shore. I sometimes catch them on crappie jigs. Hard to target them because they mode a lot.

[zhitoman]

Keep criticizing foreigners, but at least we don't use trout for catfish bait like some people on this forum. Another thing, many of you practice catch and realize. You need to realize that most of pike and pickerel you guys release, do not survive due to excessive handling. Every day somebody posts pictures holding fish by its gills with blood leaking all over, and then claims that the fish was released "to fight another day." You better of keeping that fish and feeding it to your cats because it has no chances of survival with damaged gills and half of it protective slime coat gone. Not to mention, who in their right mind uses live bait ice fishing with tip ups and expects to release fish uninjured?

[zhitoman]

Back in Ukraine, fish of all sizes were kept to feed families as a necessity as fish was rarely available at the market and the ones that were sold smelled like diesel. Even my family questions my catch and release reasoning time and time again. It takes decades to change people's outlook and only if they are open to it. I have some foreign fisherman that practice strict catch and release but it's not the norm. I see the same in our estuary and salt fisheries when it comes to stripers and fluke
Western Ukraine has poor fishery, but Central and Eastern Ukraine has so many species its crazy. Even sunfish, bullheads, and channels live there.

[zhitoman]

In the spring they spawn and big ones are close to shore. I sometimes catch them on crappie jigs. Hard to target them because they mode a lot.

Share a spot? I love catching them and eating them.:)

[stevejordan]

Keep criticizing foreigners, but at least we don't use trout for catfish bait like some people on this forum. Another thing, many of you practice catch and realize. You need to realize that most of pike and pickerel you guys release, do not survive due to excessive handling. Every day somebody posts pictures holding fish by its gills with blood leaking all over, and then claims that the fish was released "to fight another day." You better of keeping that fish and feeding it to your cats because it has no chances of survival with damaged gills and half of it protective slime coat gone. Not to mention, who in their right mind uses live bait ice fishing with tip ups and expects to release fish uninjured?

ive only been on this site for a couple years but ive never seen anyone post a picture of a fish bleeding out and saying they released it...

also how is using a legally harvested trout for bait wrong in any way?

and lastly, everyone uses live bait on tip ups... been using live bait on tip ups since i was a kid and probably 99% of fish ive caught have been lip hooked or hooked just inside the mouth. once in a while youll get a gut hooked fish but that is just something that happens in the sport of fishing. the only way to prevent that is to not fish...

[zhitoman]

and lastly, everyone uses live bait on tip ups... been using live bait on tip ups since i was a kid and probably 99% of fish ive caught have been lip hooked or hooked just inside the mouth. once in a youll get a gut hooked fish but it happens. the only way to prevent that is to not fish...

Tip ups are not meant for catch and release. I don't know where and how you fish, but there is no way you catch 99% of fish lip hooked, unless you fish with 1 tip up and stay near it. About using trout for bait, trout is such a precious resource, it should be either consumed or released.

[stevejordan]

Tip ups are not meant for catch and release. I don't know where and how you fish, but there is no way you catch 99% of fish lip hooked, unless you fish with 1 tip up and stay near it. About using trout for bait, trout is such a precious resource, it should be either consumed or released.

my location is in the top right corner of this post. if youre ever in the area pm and we can hit the ice and you can see for yourself. as far as the trout, the only people i know that keep trout for bait are keeping stockies. whats the difference if its consumed by a person or another fish?

[stevejordan]

not trying to be in a pissing match. i understand that your frustrated by the comments about foreigners but dont take it out on people that use tip ups and c&r

[Andrushkin33]

To be fair I only bash when its deserved.

I am sorry but you do not need 50 crappies and I have seen it time after time. Yeah I love to eat them but 50. Come on.

As far as pike or pickerel handling I do agree. I need a lot of practice to learn the proper release technique and solid advice from people here helps me out a lot. Still I have a long way to go. One thing to say it was released unharmed another to have it actually survive after you have released it.

Andre

[lennysky]

Share a spot? I love catching them and eating them.:)
Almost all lakes have them. I've seen them in mountain lakes

[lennysky]

We all have uneducated fisherman among our waterways and it is our job to educate them gently. In terms of fish mortality, it is true that a fraction of fish survives rough handling. Especially in waters already low in oxygen or too warm. So I would vote to rather keep a few unfortunate fish which are hurt vs sticking strictly to CR.

[FASTEDDIE29]

[QUOTE=zhitoman;390621]Keep criticizing foreigners, but at least we don't use trout for catfish bait like some people on this forum.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!! Here we go again with the Trout used as bait drama. OMG!!!:D

[GetANet]

They all come out in the winter cause!!!!!! F'em All Buddy!!!
I love you no matter what kind of bait you use!!!!!
This shit is getting SO BORING, NOBODY wants to hear it!!!
If I wanna hear Bitchin About EVERYTHING all I gotta do is find my Old Lady!!!!

[saxmatt]

Trout make awesome bait and most of the pike and muskie I catch on tipups survive. I've seen the same fish get caught over and over and I've caught fish with severed gills hanging out of the gill plate and they survived that injury. I've heard the "they're gonna die anyway" excuse from the bucket brigade before. Bottom line is fish are heartier than most people think, but when you are planning on releasing a fish be prepared and try to return the fish in the best condition possible.

[jimcnj]

ive only been on this site for a couple years but ive never seen anyone post a picture of a fish bleeding out and saying they released it...

.

Agree. I never seen that either.
Also, using legally caught fish as bait is not necessarily unethical, trout or not.

[zhitoman]

Agree. I never seen that either.
Also, using legally caught fish as bait is not necessarily unethical, trout or not.

Search Passaic river pike in this forum. So many bleeding pike it makes me sick. Many of those posts don't say whether the fish was released or not, but who in their right mind would keep pike from the Passaic river? So I am assume they were released.

[lennysky]

Zhitoman your have a point. Numerous times I caught fish injured by fisherman, cormorants and other fish. But the question remain, how many actually die? I'm sure there is a study on mortality. There was for stripers and this is why they were pushing circle hooks.

[15FOOTER]

I like to use 4inch native browns from the south branch to catch 15lb lakers in round valley...some times youll even get huge rainbows and browns on them lol..the key is that they have to be native..everyone knowz stockiez dont work duh....lol go back to gst troll boy

[lennysky]

Everyone knows Atlantic salmon smolts work best so leave those baby trout alone and go get some of those

[15FOOTER]

Omg never thought of that..wonder how many i can keep alive in my bucket?

[Jigman13]

Just to chime in here... The pike in my avatar was taken on a tip up. It was out of the water a few minutes for measurements and photos. It was then released, swimming away just fine. It was then confirmed to me that the fish was caught about 6 months later on open water by another angler...again, she was released.

These fish are more resilient than most people realize...

Sometimes it's best to keep overly controversial comments to one's self...you feel a certain way or have a particular opinion? Practice as you deem fit and within reason. Bashing people for being within the legal means of fish & game laws is absurd; especially the trout thing. If an angler buys a license and trout stamp, he/she is allowed to do what they wish with their legal limit of trout, end of story. Bucket brigades keeping everything is whole 'nother ball o wax!

[Eskimo]

Another thing, many of you practice catch and realize. You need to realize that most of pike and pickerel you guys release, do not survive due to excessive handling. Every day somebody posts pictures holding fish by its gills with blood leaking all over, and then claims that the fish was released "to fight another day." You better of keeping that fish and feeding it to your cats because it has no chances of survival with damaged gills and half of it protective slime coat gone.

There's an old saying, "You can shear a sheep many times - but you can only skin him once.".

Is the value in a bass the experience fishing outdoors and catching a nice bass - or is it in frying up a few mercury-contaminated fillets? I go with the former. The best parts of bass fishing is the experience of fishing and catching - not killing.

At home I keep a small collection of chewed-up plastic baits. These are all someone else's baits that bass barfed up after I caught them. What it means to me is that catch-and-release works!

I don't know who these baits belonged to, but I know there are at least two bass fishermen who share the wonderful experience of catching the same trophy bass. Isn't that amazing?

In NJ, a four pound bass is about 10 years old. In the average over-fished NJ lake, that bass has probably been caught every one of those years, probably several times a year. She is one in a million -literally if you consider how many bass are hatched and how many grow to a memorable size. How many anglers have shared this experience of catching this same fish in her lifetime?

You are free to look down on our catch-and-release culture. Yes, Americans are dreamers and optimistic fools. We catch fish that we have every right to kill, yet we put them back in the water in the naive hope that this fish will grow bigger, populate the water with babies, and make another fisherman's day who will in turn place in her back in the water. We foolishly hope that our children will experience the same fishing opportunities that we had.

I would rather be an optimistic fool who sustains the fishery for my fellow anglers than a shameless consumer of gamefish who cares only about their own self-gratification.


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[Gatto1227]

Fish bleed especially when you drive hooks into their face and making them fight for their lives. That's fishing. I'd rather release a bleeding pike and give it a chance over shoving it in a bucket where it has zero chance.

[lennysky]

Eskimo, I understand your point and practice CR 90% of the time. However, if one is to be educated on Limnology, Ichthyology and basic conservation principals it is clear that keeping some of the fish ((Mercury or not) is not only healthy but necessary for the lake in order to sustain bigger fish vs numbers of stunted ones. I personally conducted an experiment on a 40 acre upstate lake where following numerous bass contests no large fish was left as the rules of contest required in person in the store weigh ins and not a fisherman brought these large one ( up to 9lb) fish back. When I started fishing the lake, vast majority of bass were bowering around 12-13 inches and very skinny. So I decided to keep and eat numerous 9-12 inch fish to thin the crowd. Within 5 years the average size of bass improved to 14-16" with several 5+lb fish mixed in. Not only I was fishing but I knew all that did and I queried w them. Across the board they agreed to a great improvement.

Another example is a well known private lake in west Windsor NY where's verbal fishermen believed that killing all tiny perch they catch benefited the ecosystem only to discover that eventually bigger fish starved to death due to lack of forage. It is not cut and dry across the board, but strict CR never works in long term improvements to a fishery. If pike not kept in Passaic river eventually 99% of pike will be hammer handles with a few decent ones which will caninalize on the smaller brethren. I am against bucket brigades regardless of ethnicity only because they do not adhere to the established regulations but they too play a role.

[Chrisper4694]

I caught a pike with one of its gills hanging out and all white. I said wow this fish is still swimming around ok??? Released it. 2 months later in the same area I caught that same pike...still ok. I'm just throwing in another experience of fish being resilient.

As far as 100% c&r... Look up how they run those personal giant bass lakes that guys like bill dance fish on tv and only catch tons of giants. Lennysky is right, keeping small legal fish helps a lake grow more big fish! I know you all know a private lake where no one ever keeps a bass...and the mass of the population is 12-15" most likely. Look at rvr with the lakers no big ones over 30 pulled out this year. We do our part and take every laker in the slot because of the stunted lake trout population. Not enough forage there for them with the over stocking when they thought they wouldn't reproduce successfully. Nothing goes to waste, plenty of people love fresh fish.

Do what you want within the rules one way or the other but don't turn people off from keeping small legal fish please, it helps grow trophy sized fish. But please release the big ones

[lennysky]

Yes, big fish with good genetics Ned an opportunity to spread their genes

[saxmatt]

Yes, big fish with good genetics Ned an opportunity to spread their genes
I agree 100%! It's also cool to see another angler catch the same big fish you released. I caught a state record and let her go, 3 guys have caught her since and released her. Catch and release works!

[lennysky]

State record pike?

[saxmatt]

State record pike?
No, John Viglione still has that record. I haven't ever seen a pike over the low 20 pound range posted on the NJ sites.

[zhitoman]

There's an old saying, "You can shear a sheep many times - but you can only skin him once.".

Is the value in a bass the experience fishing outdoors and catching a nice bass - or is it in frying up a few mercury-contaminated fillets? I go with the former. The best parts of bass fishing is the experience of fishing and catching - not killing.

At home I keep a small collection of chewed-up plastic baits. These are all someone else's baits that bass barfed up after I caught them. What it means to me is that catch-and-release works!

I don't know who these baits belonged to, but I know there are at least two bass fishermen who share the wonderful experience of catching the same trophy bass. Isn't that amazing?

In NJ, a four pound bass is about 10 years old. In the average over-fished NJ lake, that bass has probably been caught every one of those years, probably several times a year. She is one in a million -literally if you consider how many bass are hatched and how many grow to a memorable size. How many anglers have shared this experience of catching this same fish in her lifetime?

You are free to look down on our catch-and-release culture. Yes, Americans are dreamers and optimistic fools. We catch fish that we have every right to kill, yet we put them back in the water in the naive hope that this fish will grow bigger, populate the water with babies, and make another fisherman's day who will in turn place in her back in the water. We foolishly hope that our children will experience the same fishing opportunities that we had.

I would rather be an optimistic fool who sustains the fishery for my fellow anglers than a shameless consumer of gamefish who cares only about their own self-gratification.


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Why you even mentioning bass when I was talking about pike and pickerel? Bass are perfect fish for catch and release due to their anatomical structure and their tolerance to high temperatures. When did I say that I look down on catch and release? When I catch a fish I don't intend to keep, I try not to even touch it with my hands. I unhook it and let it go. All of you guys telling stories about catching the same injured pike many times. It's just an exception to the rule.
You need to realize that pike are cold water fish who live way up north, almost up to the arctic circle and the summer temperatures we get in NJ are harmful for them. Why do you think they do not spawn here? Because It's too hot here. So if you catch a pike in the Passaic river in July using your crank bait with 3 treble hooks, unhook it for about 5 minutes while the fish is getting its gills burned by hot air, then grab it by its gills so your buddies can take a hundred pictures of you with a big fish, that fish now has very slim chances of survival. Instead of criticizing me, many of you need to learn how to handle a fish so you don't harm it. Because if you keep doing what you doing, and if the state stops stocking pike, they will disappear. Start using single barbless hooks and big soft nets, instead of those metal boga grips. Too bad instead of following my advises, you will call me a troll, well at least I tried. Maybe few people will listen to me. :)

[lennysky]

Ziti an, it's all good. No need to be upset. Just a difference in opinion of some and different approach.
Btw, pike can and do spawn in NJ right after ice out just the mortality rate of eggs and fry is extremely high. I would say 1% survive.