Passaic River Banks Private Property???

[Rickhem]

I was taking a little lunch-time fishing break today, throwing some lures on a very well-known stretch of the Passaic River, and I was asked to leave by someone that claimed I was on private property. The property in question is a business, and he has a parking lot with a guard rail that kind of defines the end of his lot. I was at least 40 yards away from his parking lot in kind of thick stuff along the bank. I didn't park in his lot, and I didn't walk ofer his property to access the bank, I just walked along it. I left when he asked, and went back to another area for another 10 minutes since it was almost time to get back to work anyway.

So my question is this: Aren't the banks of state stocked waters open for fishing? Is it possible that he owns right down to the water?

[flyboy1]

I was taking a little lunch-time fishing break today, throwing some lures on a very well-known stretch of the Passaic River, and I was asked to leave by someone that claimed I was on private property. The property in question is a business, and he has a parking lot with a guard rail that kind of defines the end of his lot. I was at least 40 yards away from his parking lot in kind of thick stuff along the bank. I didn't park in his lot, and I didn't walk ofer his property to access the bank, I just walked along it. I left when he asked, and went back to another area for another 10 minutes since it was almost time to get back to work anyway.

So my question is this: Aren't the banks of state stocked waters open for fishing? Is it possible that he owns right down to the water?

I would of told him to call the authorities... This way you can get clarification and find out officially if its private land or not... I dont ever take someone's word as gospel... no harm or foul by having the authorities officially tell you that it is or nor private...:rolleyes:

[Rickhem]

I can understand if there is a lot of trash left there, or if people are somehow impacting his business or his property.....and maybe it really IS his property. And I know that there are places where people do own right down to the water line, but the water itself isn't anyone's property.

The water was kind of chocolate-milky looking, lots and lots of leaves, and I wasn't getting any hits or even follows, so moving wasn't a problem for me anyway.

[Eskimo]

I would of told him to call the authorities... This way you can get clarification and find out officially if its private land or not... I dont ever take someone's word as gospel... no harm or foul by having the authorities officially tell you that it is or nor private...:rolleyes:

Be careful involving the police. A lot of the time they won't know specifically whether you are on private propert or not. They'll just throw you off the property to end the issue and move on to their next call. Now there is a record of you having "tresspassed" on the property.

If you have a pair of waders, you may be able to access the property, even if it is privately owned on one side. I have always been under the impression that a land owner can not prevent people from using a navigable waterway, even if it crosses over their property.

I just looked up this website:
http://www.nationalrivers.org/us-law-who-owns.htm


It states:

The U.S. Supreme Court has held that the bed and banks under all rivers, lakes, and streams that are navigable, for title purposes, are owned by the states, held in trust for the public. Title in this context means ownership. This public-trust ownership extends up to the ordinary high water line, (or ordinary high water mark,) encompassing what is commonly referred to as the submerged and submersible land, as opposed to the upland. This type of navigability is called title navigability.



There are private trout fishing clubs in New Jersey who own land on both sides of various rivers and truly believe they 'own' the river, but if anyone takes them to court on this, they may lose.

[Eskimo]

To that end I want to add that I know a guy who bought land in Lebanon, NJ that borders some river. It may be the South Branch of the Raritan.

The first year he owned the land, he showed up on the morning of the opening of trout season to find a dozen anglers lining the river pool on his propertry.

He told them that they were standing on his property and the anglers told him to go shit in a hat. They said they have fished that pool for decades without any problems and they could just stand in the river and not be on anybody's private property.

So, I'm going to guess that as long as your standing in or right next to the river's edge, you are not actually tresspassing.

[buzzbaiter]

Plenty of public land(I'd guess about 1/3 the river is publicly accessible or 30 miles or so) around so when in doubt, go elsewhere.

[Rickhem]

Plenty of public land(I'd guess about 1/3 the river is publicly accessible or 30 miles or so) around so when in doubt, go elsewhere.

That's what I did, but I'd still be interested if he actually owns right up to the water.

It's a spot that many, many more before me have fished, as evidenced by the forked sticks, and assorted angler garbage I saw, so I understand why he might not want people contributing to that mess, but then again, it's the Passaic river, and just as much junk gets washed up as is left there by people.

[Moz]

That's what I did, but I'd still be interested if he actually owns right up to the water.

It's a spot that many, many more before me have fished, as evidenced by the forked sticks, and assorted angler garbage I saw, so I understand why he might not want people contributing to that mess, but then again, it's the Passaic river, and just as much junk gets washed up as is left there by people.

It could have been liability concerns. If you or anyone were to take a fall or otherwise hurt themselves on private property or close enough to it he didn't want the aggravation of a lawsuit. People sue for dumb things they bring onto themselves.

Or he could have just been a jerk and boss someone around. Probably was smart to leave it well enough alone and move on after he asked.

[basspilot]

From my research of doing this once before on the ramapo river which backs up to many houses (just like the passaic) I technically dont think you can walk onto someones property. The kicker is that there are certain towns where property lines go into or through the river and in that case you are allowed in them only if no body part is touching the ground, or in this case the river bed. For example you would be allowed to take a kayak or boat through or fish in someones property baring you do not get out or land the vessel on that individuals property. That is how I perceived the regs regarding trespassing on rivers. In my honest oppinion though if your wading the river and fishing I dont see a problem with that as long as your not fishing from the bank. The river and fish were here more than likely long before that person was so I dont see any harm in it. Then again I am an avid angler so that might be slightly bias :D .

[MaCe1]

You probably have to go to the town or county to check the property lot , one of them should have a survey defining boundaries of the property.

[Zupa da Bass]

I was just parusing through this interesting thread and you really have to love the group of fisherman who told the new landowner to " go shit in a hat " something about that phrase kills me

[Mark B.]

From my research of doing this once before on the ramapo river which backs up to many houses (just like the passaic) I technically dont think you can walk onto someones property. The kicker is that there are certain towns where property lines go into or through the river and in that case you are allowed in them only if no body part is touching the ground, or in this case the river bed. For example you would be allowed to take a kayak or boat through or fish in someones property baring you do not get out or land the vessel on that individuals property. That is how I perceived the regs regarding trespassing on rivers. In my honest oppinion though if your wading the river and fishing I dont see a problem with that as long as your not fishing from the bank. The river and fish were here more than likely long before that person was so I dont see any harm in it. Then again I am an avid angler so that might be slightly bias :D .


Check the tax maps & see where the boundary lines are. Some are actually drawn on the bottom of streams. In that case, they own the land @ the bottom of the stream. If any part of you comes in contact with it, it is trespassing. If you are floating in a canoe, you are legal. However, if you anchor, or the sinker / bait comes in contact with the bottom it can be construed as trespassing,.........LAWYERS!!!@*#&%$!!

Sometimes, landowners will post signs to relieve themselves of any liability should you get injured while on their property. Ask them,.........often, they will let you fish

[Rickhem]

Sometimes, landowners will post signs to relieve themselves of any liability should you get injured while on their property. Ask them,.........often, they will let you fish

Last year I stopped in this business and asked if they minded me fishing in the river out back, and a guy came out of his office specifically to tell me that I couldn't. He made it a point of saying no.

I fished by that area a couple times since then without issue, but yesterday he gave me the boot.

No problem, lots and lots of areas to fish beside that spot.

[ithaca10]

I rad on another site they closed the ramp on Camp Lane and also the one in Eeast Hanover is now being patrolled by the Essex Cty Sheriffs Dept.

[kcritch]

I rad on another site they closed the ramp on Camp Lane and also the one in Eeast Hanover is now being patrolled by the Essex Cty Sheriffs Dept.

Why would they close the ramp? Was it private property that is not occupied and people were just using it?

[Eskimo]

I rad on another site they closed the ramp on Camp Lane and also the one in East Hanover is now being patrolled by the Essex Cty Sheriffs Dept.

I wonder if the county is in violation of the law by closing down those boat ramps. I read on the website I linked to on page 1 of this thread:

However, the state has a duty to maintain public access routes to rivers under certain conditions, as part of its public trust duties. Courts have found it unlawful for a state to close off an existing public access route when there are not other public access routes nearby.

[NorthJerzyG]

Although there is a house "near" the launch, it's posted as township property. So it's def not on someone's private land. Not sure if there were complaints or the town was worried about anglers getting "stranded" (LOL), or injured, or whatever else.

Funny to how the day I went and saw the sign (not sure how long it had been up), the very next day someone posted about the hoax that went on there. Wonder if they were justifying the closure??